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Event characters and using 'Overpowered Weapons'


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Events are fun and everyone loves them they give people something to do on the server. A lot of people's favourite parts of events are when the firefights start as they get to shoot something/someone. Events are often well balanced and fun and can either take a while or not. But they start to lose this fun when event characters are given "overpowered weapons."

Weapons such as Pulse cannons, thermal detonators and so on. I find that it is no fun to play against people with these weapons and a lot of other people would aswell this is because of the fact that they can one shot over half of the server and if given to the right people wipe out an entire hallway. I have seen that a lot of events recently in firefights have had event characters with these weapons and 1.5k health at a minimum. (I am not going to point out which em's do this).  

I believe that the main reason these weapons are overpowered is because that unless you are in certain regiments, above clearance three, sith or a donated character you will most likely get one shot. I was recently in an event with this kill feed. From peter saying why is the reactor off in comms to the bottom is in the span of 10-15 seconds.

Killfeed.thumb.jpg.bf611f95d9834f9f1a544e61384624b5.jpg

What I am suggesting is to bring in a spreadsheet or system of certain player count, off or on ship and circumstances to be brought into play to use different weapons with pulse cannons and thermal detonators being set with the highest as they are the main problems and are what can wipe out a lot of the server, even then they should also be given to only a small amount of people not all event characters. These circumstances could be such things as if we are in a choke point or whether it is part of a characters lore.

 

Thankyou for reading and I hope this can make events more enjoyable.

(If there are some oversites or something like this is already in place that I missed please tell me)

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+1

Back when I was still playing, whenever I came across an Event character who would mercilessly shoot me (for no good reason mind you) with an overpowered weapon, I would just straight up quit the event and have nothing to do with it because I knew that all I would be useful for during the event was adding to the kill feed. Believe it or not, being murdered over and over again and going up against unrealistically powerful engineers and troopers. We need balanced event characters and more of them so they can be more of an obvious threat and so that more strategy can be used against them; it's stupid that a couple of immortal gods are able to takeover an entire populated and armed Star Destroyer.

Edited by SCHEFF
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Based on my personal experiences as an event master over the past two years, there is a fine line between event characters being too OP and too underpowered. The main reason the event characters have either extremely high health or high powered weapons (or sometimes both) is due to the amount of people on during an event. I understand that yes, you may get one shot by a hostile player, but at the same time they can have between 5 and 25 people shooting towards them at once averaging between 15-75 shots depending on the number of Troopes and their weapons, which are dealing between 50 and 200 damage per hit. It is usually this amount of damage coming their way which forces them to be “OP” so that the event can last longer than 5 seconds.

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I am gonna go stay on the fence this is an RP server i am fine with the OP weapons if Taking health The Sith get an lightsaber witch is power full and 800 health if those troopers had health like OP Troopers so mabey 500-700 witch is good as normal people stand a chance to take them down

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I do agree and I will admit that I can get out of hand with not balancing out weapons and health but 'Smuggler Illi' seen in the screenshot killed a bunch of troopers - That was me as the job as the troopers kept going up the Reactor Room Elevator when having strict orders from the Generals not to, This can also be seen on off-ship events if troopers decide to disobey orders a 'landmine' (meteor) will be spawned on the trooper killing them so they will return back to the LZ - It has been talked about in our weekly meetings on how we can handle this without using our powers so we keep it in RP.

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Hi @Joel, I have a few responses to your post.

 

While the use of overpowered weapons can ruin an event, they are also, without a question, the most useful tool in the arsenal of an event master.  Lets propose a fictional event, where I have 8 event characters with 1000 health, a standard E-11 equivalent and a (water)pistol.  Lets also assume there are 80 combat ready personell on the server (this doesn't include sith) with an average of 175 health (given all the higher rank, health boosts .etc).  In this situation, the Imperials have ten times the fire and man power, allowing for individual s to be killed in a much more efficient way.  Their combined health pool is also 6000 larger, and is spread out.  Keep in mind that this comparison does not take into account the Pulse cannons, E-11D's .etc of certain imperial regiments.  So if Event masters want to create a fair fight, we need to greatly increase the health of each character, something that is already unreasonable, or we need to increase the firepower of the troops we have.  Now EVEN if we added a zero to all the weapons our people use, the numerical advantage of the troopers outclasses that of the event characters.  The other solution that we do use is allowing respawns, but this can be (in part) negated by the fact that troopers can also respawn, and with their overwhelming numerical advantage, they can "camp" spawn sights.  This is why we give people guns like pulse rifles to attack from a distance and even the odds, and we also give them grenades to dispatch multiple enemies in a cluster.  Remember, these advantages are a minimum if we want to give the characters a fighting chance, much ales ever have them beat the server.  

 

While I do understand that It can be frustration for individuals involved, and that events (like the one you showed above) can be overpowered, restricting weapons would be a HUGE detriment to the abilities of an event master.  If we could only use certain weapons, a large amount of "loadout variety and creativity" would disappear.  What guns charcter(s) have can really effect the roleplay of a situation.

 

I will appologise oin the behalf of the EM team for your bad experience, but I strongly disagree that a spreadsheet should be implemented.  Taking into consideration the points above (that they are not OP when viewed from a server wide perspective, it would ruin RP) and the sheer logistical task of creating a spreadsheet and maintaining it to fix the arbitrary number selection we male, all for little to no benefit to the overall experience.  If we did this, it would (unfortunately) result in 2 min events where about 4 people are killed and event characters can't achieve any objectives.

 

This being said, I will discuss this with all other EM's in our weekly meeting and add a paragraph on this to the EM guidelines that are a WIP.  Even if I or the rest of the staff team disagree, we do value your feedback.

 

Cheers,

Goliath

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12 minutes ago, SCHEFF said:

+1

Back when I was still playing, whenever I came across an Event character who would mercilessly shoot me (for good reason mind you) with an overpowered weapon, I would just straight up quit the event and have nothing to do with it because I knew that all I would be useful for during the event was adding to the kill feed. Believe it or not, being murdered over and over again and going up against unrealistically powerful engineers and troopers. We need balanced event characters and more of them so they can be more of an obvious threat and so that more strategy can be used against them; it's stupid that a couple of immortal gods are able to takeover an entire populated and armed Star Destroyer.

+1

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33 minutes ago, pinejack said:

Based on my personal experiences as an event master over the past two years, there is a fine line between event characters being too OP and too underpowered. The main reason the event characters have either extremely high health or high powered weapons (or sometimes both) is due to the amount of people on during an event. I understand that yes, you may get one shot by a hostile player, but at the same time they can have between 5 and 25 people shooting towards them at once averaging between 15-75 shots depending on the number of Troopes and their weapons, which are dealing between 50 and 200 damage per hit. It is usually this amount of damage coming their way which forces them to be “OP” so that the event can last longer than 5 seconds.

Literally everything here ^^^^

As a past EM, I can say that yes, while it’s annoying to be killed by a hostile with a large amount of HP, that same hostile, not only has to deal with you attacking them, but the entire server. Thus, making it almost essential that they have a good weapon and over 1000 hp, or else the event will be over in less then 5 mins.

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This IS and always HAS been a touchy topic. Both EM's and Joel have a point to note and are correct to a certain degree. 

In my experience with events, event masters seem to have a good idea of what weapons and health to give event characters so that the event can be longer than 5 seconds as @Goliath has noted. And personally, I enjoy PassiveRP events more than general combat events, but there is always the occasional unique and fun combat events that I enjoy Immensely. 

In my opinion, the event masters have found a good balance in how to set up events as that IS their JOB after all. But I do feel that Joel & Scheff's comments should not go un-noticed as there IS always that fine balance that occasionally goes against the players and that can and has caused a lot of anger among the player base.

Edited by Brass
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In my opinion the worst parts of events that ive seen is when 2000 hp characters with op weps have to get to point A to point B in the ship (e.g mh2 > bridge) just leads to walking death. Though not much can be done about this besides changing the event itself which might not be viable. 

For instances when we are assaulting the event characters (rebel base) i think a slight health nerf plus a good healthy dose of cannon fodder npcs would work well to decrease this OPness of individuals whilst providing the satisfaction of killing for players. Not sure if the server has the mod but i know back in the TGC days they had an AI mod which allowed you to set players to sides so enemy NPCS wouldnt shoot 'friendly' event characters.

Just my two cents

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6 minutes ago, Ragetank said:

In my opinion the worst parts of events that ive seen is when 2000 hp characters with op weps have to get to point A to point B in the ship (e.g mh2 > bridge) just leads to walking death. Though not much can be done about this besides changing the event itself which might not be viable. 

For instances when we are assaulting the event characters (rebel base) i think a slight health nerf plus a good healthy dose of cannon fodder npcs would work well to decrease this OPness of individuals whilst providing the satisfaction of killing for players. Not sure if the server has the mod but i know back in the TGC days they had an AI mod which allowed you to set players to sides so enemy NPCS wouldnt shoot 'friendly' event characters.

Just my two cents

In saying this, we are not allowed to use NPCs above 50 players, so this is not a viable solution to the issue as you would be substituting beefier hostile with extreme lag.

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Yes, this IS a touchy subject.

 

In the past, the point in events wasn't to allow the EVENT CHARACTERS the ability to have fun (Yes, it is hoped that they can have fun as well) but for the people using THEIR RP roles. With the use of Insane amounts of HP and insane DPS weapons, this removes the latter while enforcing the former. 

 

As addressed by the EMs and Ex EMs of this server, having a group of even 5 or more people with E11s can kill an Event Character with 1000 hp in 4 shots each (Assuming that there are 5 people, they all hit the target directly for 50 dmg each [standard damage for E11] for all 4 shots). That is the bare FACT. However, you are never going to get that. There is going to be like 5-10 grouped event characters heading to their objective with 5000 HP each and maybe a Commander with 7500 HP, each having shit like pulse cannons or RPGs or E11Ds, etc. Shit that does heaps of damage that would wipe out any opposition. Also, you aren't EVER going to get an organized formation to fire against the hostile Event Characters. This is not the American Civil War. It is going to be scattered firefights from 1-4 imperials against the hostiles because that is what respawns first. There will also be the occasional minge or 2 that will ruin any attempted organized defense.

 

Now let's look at the Event Characters themselves for this one. First: Rebels. 

Rebels are literally ragtag insurgents wanting to do their part to overthrow the Empire. They won't be super soldiers with HP equal to that for 15 Storm Troopers. They won't have the most insane weapons. They will have what they can get.

 

2nd: Droids: Droids won't have the intellect of an actual soldier and if one is using Droids, clearly they are skimping out and won't have insane HP or weapons (At least for the standard B1s)

 

3rd: Bounty Hunters / Mandalorians: The Empire Heavily Employed Notable Bounty Hunters to track down Rebel Cells in the Empire and as a result, usually wouldn't be fighting them. They don't have agendas. Mandalorians were Imperials. They wouldn't openly fight the Empire because then their clan would be wiped out.

 

The ONLY way to fix the issue of insane HPs and weapons is to have More Event Characters. That usually cannot happen to account for server stability or whether or not enough people actually volunteer for the Event Spots. The Best Balanced Events are those that are like 50v50 or those that have limited spawns.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Mauler said:

 

The ONLY way to fix the issue of insane HPs and weapons is to have More Event Characters. That usually cannot happen to account for server stability or whether or not enough people actually volunteer for the Event Spots. The Best Balanced Events are those that are like 50v50 or those that have limited spawns.

 

 

I love this point.

i feel like in order to have more event character, event characters themselves need to be rewarded some sort of “initiative” to participate. 

Imo having more 50v50 sort of events would be crazy and put this server on another level than it’s already on. Obviously this is to say the least a very large logistical challange but I believe the event staff are talented enough to pull more of this off. 

 

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There's guidelines in place for event characters, if the EM's aren't following them, take it up with Welshy, he takes these things very seriously.

The management team have even put in preset characters of which don't have a health over 750.

However, if there are 10 event characters and 90 players, some things need to be changed so that it isn't just a slaughter.

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This is hard to do, as a previous Head EM on other servers that don't much use players as Event Characters, and mainly use NPC's. 

The hard part of having players is the fact that, both sides become competitive, wanting to kill as many people as possible (even sub-consciously people do it sometimes) and do their best (as the Event Master wants them to do) to create chaos and make it harder for the players to win.

In a perfect world and scenario for the Event Master, 50 people would put their hand up and say "Yes! Let's all do it!" and split the server players into a 50/50 population and it would be a war of attrition, which would be awesome. However, the problem with this, in theory, is that not everybody wants to swap sides and be a "bad" guy (good guy) and fight the players.

So, the Event Master decides to have fewer people, whatever, war of attrition it is. The Event Characters, however, get absolutely slaughtered due to their dwindling and lower numbers and it becomes too easy for ST's and boring and frustrating for the rebels or EC's.

The Event Master decides to up the ante and gives the EC's better HP and a better gun, they do better but still fail miserably, it's still a slaughter and makes it hard for the EC's to have fun and the EM to enact a story.

The Event Master does this until it becomes easy for the EC's to win, and its a slaughter, each EC is somewhat a juggernaut, however, they are eventually worn down and killed. The players are angry about this and get annoyed and frustrated, but it allows for the Event Master to tell his story and it makes the event somewhat hard for the players.

 

Overall, in order for an Event not to go for 10 minutes, the way to do that is to make it hard for the players, if it's a bit frustrating, it's a bit frustrating, there's not much you can apart from having a bunch of EC's, and that's not going to happen because people don't want to play EC's a lot.

 

My only advice would be, give people a small number of credits for playing as an EC, not too much, 100-200, however, after doing it a lot you can get quite a few points for items that you want in the long run.

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Event Characters with 2000 hp and rocket launchers are not fun. Sometimes there are even people who have been scaled down, which I personally believe should be banned for aggressive events.

Edited by Bevan
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Hi Joel,

You have a few very valid points however I would just like to put in my opinion on this topic. Events shouldn't be easy for troopers by any means, they are supposed to be challenging and make you think outside of the box. These events aren't supposed to be XP farms or give you kills, Yes we may use "Op" Weapons but that isn't because we just want to cause chaos and rack up kills. We are trying to get you to use your skills to overcome this bump and to improve. As well as this we usually adapt to the situation for E.g if the event characters are just straight up dying instantly we will give them more health or give them better "Op" or if the event characters are too "Op" we will usually adjust their health or weapons. Basically what Omo has stated.

Thanks

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1 hour ago, Bevan said:

Event Characters with 2000 hp and rocket launchers are not fun. Sometimes there are even people who have been scaled down, which I personally believe should be banned for aggressive events.

In my experience, I have never encountered or made an event character with 2000hp and Rocket launchers. I personally don't give any of my EC's (Event Character's) Rocket launchers as they may abuse this. 

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